2012 Northern Contest Information
Beverly International Nutrition Support Forum Beverly Nutrition Contest Prep Diuretics Pre Contest|
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Guru Member |
Recently I spoke to a kid (21 yrs old) who had just competed in his second show. Last year I helped him out the final 4 weeks and he ended up winning his junior's class. I really can't take any credit for it since his genetics are off the hook crazy. I asked him how he did at this recent show, and he told me not too well. I saw him a week prior this show in the gym and he looked amazing. Someone new was advising him and I thought that whoever this guy was, really knew his stuff.
Well, the kid asked me what else to do at one week out, and I told him "nothing, you look great. Just take some extra Ultra 40 Liver the last 3 days to dry you out further". So how did he wind up "flat with no muscle" (in his own words) the day of the show? After questioning him extensively as to what he did the final week, here's what I discovered: His coach advised him to use an OTC diuretic the final 2 days while dropping his water intake to 1/2 a gallon on both days. BINGO!!! The part that really upsets me is that this kid's "coach" actually charged him money for his advice. I would rather have someone do nothing different the final week, then do something totally alien, ruining all the hard work. If you look good 1 week out, you should look even better on show day. Keep water high, stay away from herbal diuretics, take some extra vitamin C, double up on the Ultra 40, and you are all set. Aram N. Hamparian Pro Natural Bodybuilder |
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Aram, that obviously didn't work for him. It may have worked for another one of the coach's clients. Have the "kid" try it your way again, and as you say, "BINGO!" You'll know for sure and that's what he needs to do.
I haven't tried keeping water in. That's my next contest. I will definitely contact you for details. OTC diruetics worked for me and the next time...F.L.A.T! There wasn't any PB either. LOL Frank Frank "Lift and be happy. Lift harder and be excited...Get Excited, Get Big!!!" |
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Frank,
If you are willing, I can also guide you as well as I have never left water out for the whole last week and came in hard each time!! It could work like you said, but its a russian roulette to see if its works as you found out the 2nd time!! NO diuretics, no potassium either as they can pull water from the muscles as well as the subcutaneous level!! just high water throught, Sodium tracking the whole week with small drops at the end, not to zero, carb up highest on Mon and slowly come down as the week progresses and carbing up on sat according to your body type!! Craig Yarnall, CSCS, CPT, WNBF Pro "Lifetime Natural Bodybuilder" "Train Hard and Stay Natural" "Want A Bigger Body, Squat DEEP" "The truth is that you will probably never reach your full bodybuilding potential without doing the Squat. The squat forces your whole body to GROW!"--TOM PLATZ |
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Active Member |
I have to agree with Frank. I have done the water restriction...and the water 'loading' the way Dr. Joe does it. To be honest, I prefer to resrict the water. My last show, I was at prejudging and realized I was holding water....so I called a friend and told her what was happening...she advised me to IMMEDIATELY start eating and dont drink water. What happened? Within 30 minutes I was tighter and felt so much better. I think Dr. Joes approach can work, I just know that I didnt feel or look the way I wanted to the morning of the show.
Also, I have yet to find any OTC diuretic that has panned out. I did the Taraxatone thing one time and didnt find myself peeing any more than I usually do. Its a matter of findind a scheme that works for you...and then making the alterations from there. |
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Curt,
when you did the water loading what kind of sodium levels were you at for that week? Craig Yarnall, CSCS, CPT, WNBF Pro "Lifetime Natural Bodybuilder" "Train Hard and Stay Natural" "Want A Bigger Body, Squat DEEP" "The truth is that you will probably never reach your full bodybuilding potential without doing the Squat. The squat forces your whole body to GROW!"--TOM PLATZ |
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I dont have it with me right now. I have it at home on an excel file. I was very happy with what Dr. Joe laid out during the prep, but the last week was not quite what I would have expected. This does not say what he does is wrong...I just found that on Saturday I started to panic. Luckily I did have someone to help me through it.
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Curt on that sat your carbs might have been needed to be raised, water is low and cut off at the end of fri, drink about 6-10 oz depeding upon your size with each meal!! I am carb sensitive and if I put in too many carbs on the day of the show I would spill over in the subcutaneously!! I have used Dr. Joe for the last 5 years!!
Craig Yarnall, CSCS, CPT, WNBF Pro "Lifetime Natural Bodybuilder" "Train Hard and Stay Natural" "Want A Bigger Body, Squat DEEP" "The truth is that you will probably never reach your full bodybuilding potential without doing the Squat. The squat forces your whole body to GROW!"--TOM PLATZ |
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Hey Craig,
Stop trying to steal my future clients.LOL  I happen to also agree with Curt and Frank. Last year I had this youngster drink 3 gallons of water a day the final week, and he wound up as dry as a burnt piece of cement. We tapered down the carbs nicely (as per Craig's description)and I actually had him fat load the final 3 days, gradually increasing his consumption of peanut butter and cashews (sodium free) with each meal. This strategy made him extremely dry and vascular and really filled him out, as I cannot see how the body can get "fat" by eating fats the last 3 days. From what I've gathered, this new coach is experienced with NPC competitors, therefore, I am believing that there might be a possibility that his experience with true natural bodybuilders might be limited. His water and carb load methods seemed to have disrupted the delicate Na+/K+ balance and water dynamics, which becomes extremely sensitive in the final few days. On a similar note, I have also experienced what Curt described. Years ago I used a method which has become recently popularized as S*** Loading. This worked extremely well the day of the show ONLY. Hours before pre-judging. The trick however, was to not drink ANY water at all with whatever you were carb loading with. The one time that I did drink some water, only about 3 ounces, I completely spilled over in a matter of 15-20 minutes. If at all possible, I like to go through a trial run at about 5 weeks out with water, sodium, and carbs. Although not foolproof, it should lend some credence for what may accurately transpire the final week. As we all can attest, everyone is different. Aram N. Hamparian Pro Natural Bodybuilder |
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you got it Aram
!!I think the fta laoding works more for the ecto type bodies as we once said where I don't think that would work as well for my endo/meso bodytype!! BUt what he described just sounds like his carbs were too low for the day of the show and once he brough them up, he got very tight!! Craig Yarnall, CSCS, CPT, WNBF Pro "Lifetime Natural Bodybuilder" "Train Hard and Stay Natural" "Want A Bigger Body, Squat DEEP" "The truth is that you will probably never reach your full bodybuilding potential without doing the Squat. The squat forces your whole body to GROW!"--TOM PLATZ |
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I thought this was a common southern term. LOL 1, 2, S***Load. Frank |
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Azpronatural, what show did you do, was it in Phoenix?? I was there in April at the Best of the West an INBF pro-qualifier. Could be a small world. I am checking out this conversation about diuretics pre-contest because I have used OTC products and it did'nt really worked for me on contest day, so I am dropping it totally and just stick to water. It is strange how I looked contest ready all year and contest day I looked flat and feel soft like a marshallow.
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LOL Frank. I'm trying to be serious for once, and you're cracking jokes all day long. ahahaha Cy, I hear you regarding the fat load with meso/endo types, but it can work quite well for these bodytypes, DEPENDANT on a number of variables: a) how lean a competitor is 2 weeks out from the show. If they are just about contest ready with low bodyfat levels. b) if they pocess a quick metabolism. c) the willingness to keep carbs to a bare minimum 7-10 days prior to the final carb load/taper, which would begin a few days earlier than normal. Wednesday would commence the fat load, and on Thu and Fri continue, while having nothing but beef/grapefruit for each of the 6 meals. Now if a competitor, such as yourself has great success by manipulating carbs, then I wouldn't try to fix what ain't broke. Dr. Joe's methods work great for you. Since I am a pure ecto, I also use some of his recommendations, but can initiate the fat load into the mix without keeping my carbs too low the two week period prior. For our young friend whom I described at the beginning of this thread, I had to maintain a low carb level for 2 weeks, since he is endo/meso, and then a gradual fat load beginning on Wednesday, ultimately ending with carbs on contest day. For his next show, I'd like to try the carb taper beginning on Monday without the fat load. Aram N. Hamparian Pro Natural Bodybuilder |
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You mean, there's a slight chance I can be tied for first with you this season? |
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I won the best of the west. Please give me your opinion. Dont hold back, seriously. I felt that I could have dropped a little bit more fluid for the show. Still, I feel I looked better than I have been in the past. |
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The way Joe did it was to have me STILL at 2 gallons of H20 the day before the show. I wont go into much more of what he had me do as thats his livelyhood and if someone wants to do his 'approach' they either can find someone who wishes to divulge it...or pay Dr. Joe. I will just say that I was taking in more water than I was comfortable with at every meal on Saturday. Again, I stress that I am NOT knocking Dr. Joe. I found that eating: one box of Quacker 100% Natural Cereal, one tube of peanut butter, one package of Rice Cakes, and 3 muffins.....I went from being able to pull my skin away from my abs like elastic man to having the skin be as tight as a drum. I MAYBE had 2 - 3tbls of water after meal #2 (using dr. Joes diet) till after prejudging. It was VERY noticable. I know he does not agree with this approach, but it worked. |
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were you hitting the sodium levels he gave you to follow?? I hvae worked with him for years and I know that he does not have you drink a lot of water the day of the show 6 oz or so with each meal!! were you precise throughout the whole week to everything he gave you, protein, carbs, fats, workouts, cardio, sodium, water??
On the day of the show that doesn't sound like anything Joe would suggest to eat?? Did you follow any of the meals he gave you to eat the day of the show?? How long were you working with him before he gave you the "peak week"?? If it was short notice, then that not enough time to figure out the diet for you?? Craig Yarnall, CSCS, CPT, WNBF Pro "Lifetime Natural Bodybuilder" "Train Hard and Stay Natural" "Want A Bigger Body, Squat DEEP" "The truth is that you will probably never reach your full bodybuilding potential without doing the Squat. The squat forces your whole body to GROW!"--TOM PLATZ |
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You posted this twice and you are one of the few people I have ever seen that has been able to post pics!!
did you see my questions in between the double post?? Craig Yarnall, CSCS, CPT, WNBF Pro "Lifetime Natural Bodybuilder" "Train Hard and Stay Natural" "Want A Bigger Body, Squat DEEP" "The truth is that you will probably never reach your full bodybuilding potential without doing the Squat. The squat forces your whole body to GROW!"--TOM PLATZ |
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Let me preface all your questions by saying this...when I have ever been handed something to follow...it is done down to the last gram and letter. Without sounding corny, I become a machine. I am told to get up at 2:30am and do 17:30 minutes of cardio while balancing a book on my head...I do it. Just so you know, I asked Joe so many questions during the prep, I had to apologize because I felt like I was bombarding him. With that in mind, you can guage what my answer would be to most of the above questions. Craig, I understand that you have worked for him for five years...but you have your diet and contest prep regime with him that he worked out for just you. I dont know if you are privy to what he gives other people...but if not, then you can easily see that what he may have you do...he may not have me do. Thats the key to a 'contest prep' trainer. I worked with him from one week into the diet...up until the day of the show. That was from Jan 15th - April 16th. This is a cut/paste of what he wanted me to drink from meal #1 - #3 (not including what he had me taking in with cardio that morning) from the EXACT excel file he sent : Saturday Water - 12 oz w/ meals Sip between. I understand you are trying to be helpful, and thats commendable. I just know that the prep process I went through with him was good, but there were some things I would have liked to see done differently. You have had great success with him...and thus your continual work with him. My next show will be done differently. |
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Curt,
I understand where you are coming and each person is an individual, I know Joe works with many individuals and have seen his preps for many people who have many different bodytypes!! Raphael Calzadilla, who works with Joe, has such a metabolism and is a Bantamweight, and never drops below 175 g of carbs in his peak week, now for me that would never work!! He was even able to eat Pizza write before going on stage becasue he was that ripped and that dry but only for his last meal!! Fellow WNBF Pro Mike Carter has a Metabolism quicker than a racehorse and does even more than that where he might have 2 reeces PB cups and pizza, while my carbs are slowly filled up as I am very carb sensitive and need to slowly work that in, as WNBF Pro Mary Ford and WNBF Pro Will Vidro!! WNBF Pro 4X World Champ Nancy Andrews has great muscular development, but has very enodmorphic qualities and must drop carbs down to 50 for long stretches yet she retains lots of muscle!! I think I have done at least 7-8 shows w/ Joe and all of the "Peak Weeks" were just slightly different, no 2 were ever the same!! So even the same person changes a bit and has things to do depending upon where you come in!! Craig Yarnall, CSCS, CPT, WNBF Pro "Lifetime Natural Bodybuilder" "Train Hard and Stay Natural" "Want A Bigger Body, Squat DEEP" "The truth is that you will probably never reach your full bodybuilding potential without doing the Squat. The squat forces your whole body to GROW!"--TOM PLATZ |
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