Het,
I've been doing my gain/hardening phases awhile now and want to know if this is enough food for my gain phase. I'm 5'10 175 @8% bf, train 2 on 1 of.

Supplements
4 Ultra 40/Mass Aminos per meal ~20 daily
1 Super pak
1 scoop Creatine Select pre w/o
1-2 Antiox post w/o

Meal 1
2 eggs, 4 whites, 5oz. 90% beef,.25 cup ff cheese, .5 cups oats, .5 cup mixed berries
or
1 scoop US, 1 100% egg, 1 tbs. flax oil, .5 cup oats, .5 cup berries

Meal 2
2 scoop US, 3 tbs heavy cream
or
1.5 cups 4% cotage cheese, 1 apple
Meal 3
8 oz. chkn, 6 oz. yam, 1 cup green veg, 1 tbs light dressing
Meal 4 (pre-w/o)
2 scoops MP
Meal 5 (post w/o)
6 scoop mass maker, 5 grams creaine/glutamine
Meal 6 (~90 min later)
8-10 90% lean meat 1cup veg
or
2 eggs, 4 whites, 5 oz. 90% beef, .25 cup ff cheese, 1 cup veg
Meal 7 (right before bed)
2 scoop US, 3 tbs cream

I eat roughly every 2-3 hours and some days i'm still hungry.
Any input greatly appreciated
MikeZ

You will have to figure out how many calories that is and compare it to your base line (caloric maintenance level). I think that to add muscle mass on a gaining phase you want to be between 500 and 1,000 calories above maintenance. Being hungry is not a real good feedback mechanism. Once you get used to eating 5, 6 or 7 times day you can feel hungry a couple of hours after a meal even when you are taking in 500 to 1,000 calories/day above maintenance. If you are constantly hungry that is another thing, but now and then is normal. Our physiology is pre-programmed to tell us that we are hungry even when we might not need more food - goes back to the days of scarce food - eat now and eat more or you might starve next week when food is not available... Having 10 grocery stores to choose from is a much better existence - lol

It's about ~1000 above my maintenance. Hey, have you ever heard of the bodygem? It can calculate your RMR and give an extremely accurate measurement. Last time i used it it was around ~2300 kcal, but i'm more active and have more LBM so, i figure on my gaining phase i need ~3500, my ratios are 50% protein and 25% carbs and fat give or take a few percent. Somedays, like after leg training i can consume alomost 4000 and can still be hungry. My question is though Maddog, I should never be really hungry during a gain phase, right? Generally i eat every 2-3 hours, even at night sometimes. I've been doin this for about 6 months now and have stayed ~8-9% BF. Hardening phases are 50/30/20 and around 27-2800 kcal. I just wasns't real sure if i was eating enough, because i was so hungry all the time. I'll take any advice in with open ears, because I really respect the knowledge you pocess, you seem to be very respected her on the board, and don't be afraid to get too technical either I live and breath this stuff too.
MikeZ

Being hungry or not hungry is not the best feedback tool. What you eat can greatly impact what signals your body sends you. For example, you will feel more satisfied from a high fat meal then you will from a low gi carb meal or from a low fat protein source even thought the total calories might be similar from the meal. Our bodies are pre-programmed to desire fat, to feel unsatisfied without it and satisfied after consuming it. A BBer diet goes against this genetic pre-programming. On the other hand if you constantly feel hungry you may in fact not be getting enough calories.

I suspect that your maintenance calorie level might be a little higher than what that tool suggested. My guess would be that your maintenace level is closer to 3,000-3,200 especially since you are active and following a weight training program, and yes, more proportional LBM at the same weight requires more calories, i.e. 200 lbs at 15%bf requires fewer daily calories to stay at the same weight than does a 200 lb BBer at 8% bf. Muscle needs calories just to sustain itself, more of course if you use your muscles to exercise.

Try bumping your daily calories another 500 while you are on a gaining phase. You may find that it is helpful for recovery and for adding more LBM. If after a couple of weeks you feel that you have added too much bf, dial back. But a 500 calorie jump will not be that significant. I would stay with the same approximate micronutrient mix 60/20/20, or what ever you find works well for you. You don't, for example, want to add 300 of the extra 500 calories from fat. The hardening/gaining diet cycle has worked well for many here including myself. It keeps you from adding bf and also is beneficial for your metabolism. In a way it is a little like the twice a week carb up concept as far as using a planned diet change to help manipulate how your body is using what you consume.

There are a few BBer habits or false axioms that are hard to break, expecially for a natural lifter. We have a tendency to want to train too much (too much volume, not enough recovery time) and we also have a tendency to want to stay lean and thus hold back on total calories that might just be necessary in order to put on more LBM. Take a look at Greg Daniels articles on the BI web site. His plateau buster article does a good job of encouraging a controlled increase in calories to help create a more naturally anabolic environment. Hope this is helpful.