My goal is lose body fat, build muscle for female.
My trainer said I should be eating a small amout of protein upon waking before working out.
I usually get up at 4:30 and work out 5:30 to 6:30 then eat breakfast including carbs and protein around 7-7:30 am.
He said this is much too long to go without food. I have always been told to excerise in fasting state to lose body fat.
What are your thoughts on this?

I agree with your trainer. I would reccomend having at least a scoop or two of either muscle provider or ultimate muscle protein. Preferably muscle provider because it is faster acting.

If you dont want to go with any "food" before lifting at least have 2 scoops of glutamine select so you dont become too catabolic during training.

Khunt,
Thank you so much for taking the time to reply.
This topic is one that haunts me.. never know about the timing aspect.
What about if I am doing cardio first? Is the protein or the glutamine select also important then OR only if before lifting?

If you are just doing fasted cardio in the morning the protein or glutamine select would not be nessesary.

thanks so sorry to ask one more question but....
I do fasted cartdio after the 1/2 of lifting
so what do you think?
total 1 hr
if I drink before lifting seems to still weigh me down in the cardio....

If having a scoop of muscle provider doesnt sit well for you before training I would at least sip on a couple scoops of glutamine select before and/or during your training.

Hi so that should be lighter to digest?
will it effect my fasted cardio state for fat burning?

Yeah, actually since Glutamine Select is made up of Free Form Amino Acids (BCAAs and Glutamine) it doesnt get digested at all.It is absorbed directly into the blood cells.

It wouldnt effect your fat burning at all just help you hold onto your muscle

would straight whey protein isolate be as easily asorbed as the BCAA/glut OR does WPI actually have to be digested?

they say 5 g of BCAAS has the potency of 20-25
g's of protein, so when you use the BCAAS for preworkout or cardio don't consider your session as fasted, and thats a good thing!

The BCAA's in whey protein are "bonded", which means they must be digested and passed through the liver to be utilized. Pure BCAA's are "unbonded", thus, they are rapidly absorbed into the bloodstream and available almost immediately.

so Bcaa/Glut won't go in the stomach and easier to take then before cardio if fullness is an issue with whey?

quote:

Originally posted by MarkD.:
The BCAA's in whey protein are "bonded", which means they must be digested and passed through the liver to be utilized. Pure BCAA's are "unbonded", thus, they are rapidly absorbed into the bloodstream and available almost immediately.

That statement is assumptive, hasty, and false - all rolled into one. A relatively recent study (Power et al. 2009) showed that a 45g dose of whey protein isolate takes 40 minutes to cause blood AA levels to peak. Resulting insulin levels remain at elevations known to max out the inhibition of muscle protein breakdown (15-30 mU/L) for up to 120 minutes after ingestion. This dose takes 3 hours for insulin & AA levels to return to baseline from the point of ingestion. The inclusion of carbs to this dose would cause AA & insulin levels to peak higher & stay elevated above baseline even longer. So much for the anabolic peephole & the urgency to down AAs during your weight training workout; they are already seeping into circulation (& will continue to do so after your training bout is done).

quote:

so Bcaa/Glut won't go in the stomach and easier to take then before cardio if fullness is an issue with whey?

ARAM so how does this effect what advice I was given?
Do I still use the BCAA/GLUT instead as it is faster digesting if fullness an issue with whey before lifting/cardio?
I am confused what concern of mine your critique is addressing?

either route will work for you but accoridng to what Aram said, there is no need to do both, but either use the BCAAS preworkout or your shake and you will be fine without the overkill he mentions, right Aram?

quote:

Originally posted by virgo3:

quote:

so Bcaa/Glut won't go in the stomach and easier to take then before cardio if fullness is an issue with whey?

ARAM so how does this effect what advice I was given?
Do I still use the BCAA/GLUT instead as it is faster digesting if fullness an issue with whey before lifting/cardio?
I am confused what concern of mine your critique is addressing?

This would be impossible to answer without knowing your current stats, daily nutrition, (pro, carb, fats) and your training and cardio program.
Further, I have no idea what advice you were given... ???

quote:

Yeah, actually since Glutamine Select is made up of Free Form Amino Acids (BCAAs and Glutamine) it doesnt get digested at all.It is absorbed directly into the blood cells.

It wouldnt effect your fat burning at all just help you hold onto your muscle

Hi this was the advice above then I was asking
if Bcaa/Glut won't go in the stomach and easier to take then before cardio if fullness is an issue with whey?

quote:

Originally posted by Aram:

quote:

Originally posted by MarkD.:
The BCAA's in whey protein are "bonded", which means they must be digested and passed through the liver to be utilized. Pure BCAA's are "unbonded", thus, they are rapidly absorbed into the bloodstream and available almost immediately.

That statement is assumptive, hasty, and false - all rolled into one. A relatively recent study (Power et al. 2009) showed that a 45g dose of whey protein isolate takes 40 minutes to cause blood AA levels to peak. Resulting insulin levels remain at elevations known to max out the inhibition of muscle protein breakdown (15-30 mU/L) for up to 120 minutes after ingestion. This dose takes 3 hours for insulin & AA levels to return to baseline from the point of ingestion. The inclusion of carbs to this dose would cause AA & insulin levels to peak higher & stay elevated above baseline even longer. So much for the anabolic peephole & the urgency to down AAs during your weight training workout; they are already seeping into circulation (& will continue to do so after your training bout is done).

True...and you made my point for me. If they want the benefit of BCAA's immediately preworkout for an early AM cardio workout, a 5-10g dose of BCAA's will be almost immediately available as opposed to a whey shake, which, would not cause a considerable elevation in available BCAA's for 30-40 minutes---or after an early AM workout is cardio complete.

So, tell, me how my statement was assumptive (...assuming what??), hasty (...I spoke too fast??), or false (speed of increased blood levels of intact whey vs. free BCAA's is well known and researched). The study you quote is exactly why I recommending free BCAA's over whey protein for the early AM cardio......

if cardio follows a 30 minute weight training session first, then they whey maybe an option, based on what you mentioned, right?

But if cardio only, instead of fasted cardio which is not muscle sparing, then BCAA before hand,right?

quote:

This would be impossible to answer without knowing your current stats, daily nutrition, (pro, carb, fats) and your training and cardio program.

Hello Virgo3,
Everyone has pretty much answered your general question but as Aram stated above, post your stats, ie weight, height, age, female, male, your nutrition intake, timing of nutrition, and your specific training regimen and cardio program...how often and how long? That should help everyone give you and educated response.

You do pose a great question though and everyone including myself eats or drinks differently pre or post workout depending on what your goals are. I too workout at 5am and I do 2 scoops UpLift, 1 scoop Creatine Select and 1 Scoop Muscle Synergy prior to workout, then 4 scoops Glutamine while I workout with 1 scoop extra of Uplift then I have my post workout meal after training of Muscle Provider mixed with Oatmeal and half a grapefruit courtesy of Natty Nutrition where I am receiving help.

So as you see, there is alot of knowlege on this forum and thanks for posting your question though....keep them coming


Happy Easter everyone!